what i'm seeing, and when you look at the early-voting numbers in these battleground states i was in nevada and those early voting numbers are really good. so i would -- i think numbers don't lie, and you have got to look at the turnout so far. >> stephanie: i haven't north carolina. do you know -- what are the latest numbers you have heard? >> it just seems like you know, african american students, they are discouraged, they are not going to turn out, blah blah blah. well, so far they have been turning out and turning out in huge numbers. north carolina was exceedingly close in 2008 so look it is going to be tough, but it certainly isn't this -- it's interesting. the pundits write off certain states, i think in part to make it a horse race. >> stephanie: yeah, sure. >> romney has north carolina so we can give that to his total, and how close can we make this, but the truth is you know, the only thing we can really say is it is incumbent upon every citizen to express their viewpoint by voting and participating, and the numbers will be what they will be. >> stephanie: ben, in the state where